tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post5481472789564875175..comments2008-06-26T20:45:41.062-04:00Jeremiah Mosshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11791516443125872364noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-75340822341161275692008-06-26T20:45:00.000-04:002008-06-26T20:45:00.000-04:00jeff, wow--thanks for writing in. the internet is both good and bad, but this is its major good point, connecting strangers in surprising ways. we'd love to hear from you about this "story of two ratners." <BR/><BR/>maybe best to email me offline at jeremoss(at)yahoo(dot)(com) so we can put together a follow up story.Jeremiah Mosshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11791516443125872364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-36737078898353536922008-06-26T18:44:00.000-04:002008-06-26T18:44:00.000-04:00Hi..nice post.<BR/><BR/>Abraham Harmatz, owner of the 2nd Avenue Ratner's (yes it did exist! heheh) was my grandfather. I was about 3 yrs old when he died, but I do have vague memories of him and the restaurant and have some pictures of he and I together. His wife Mildred (my grandmother) was a very good artist. Many of her paintings adorn my home. <BR/><BR/>Anyway, I'm not sure of the story regarding Ratner's and the two branches of the family...I always had the inclination to visit the Delancey street location to meet my cousins, but never did. <BR/><BR/>I will ask my mother about this...maybe she or my aunt can shed some light on things. I'll try to post here soon when I find out.Jeffnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-31816410415435571672008-04-13T16:57:00.000-04:002008-04-13T16:57:00.000-04:00What is now Moishe's Bakery next door to the 2nd Ave Ratner's was indeed still Ratner's Bakery when I moved to the area in 77. It was Ratner's for 10-15 more years, I think. As Moishe's it has changed little from its Ratners days.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-69746975927507858282008-04-05T20:16:00.000-04:002008-04-05T20:16:00.000-04:00I used to live in the EV in the late 60s and to us hippies, who, in those days, never went as far as Delancey, and hardly south of Houston, Ratners on 2nd was THE Ratners. <BR/><BR/>I never even knew there was a Delancey Ratner's until I passed it in the 70s.<BR/><BR/>Ratner's on Second was, I believe, a dairy restaurant, as was Rappaport's, and, indeed, there as a Ratner's bakery next door.<BR/><BR/>Ratners on Second used to stay open quite late, say, midnight, maybe even beyond on weekends.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-22278763632607117852008-04-04T21:03:00.000-04:002008-04-04T21:03:00.000-04:00Absolutely phenomenal research. You should write a book. (But don't sell it at Barnes & Noble...gotta keep them in the suburbs!)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-1413041370174982252008-04-04T12:48:00.000-04:002008-04-04T12:48:00.000-04:00Moshies bakery used to be called Ratners bakery when I was a kid.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-8282978652857340252008-04-04T12:46:00.000-04:002008-04-04T12:46:00.000-04:00Moishes bakery next doorAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-87575747737513856012008-04-04T09:12:00.000-04:002008-04-04T09:12:00.000-04:00I could've saved everyone a lot of trouble if I had knocked off John Sexton when he was the debate coach at my high school...BaHanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-64854323781039180122008-04-03T21:59:00.000-04:002008-04-03T21:59:00.000-04:00My father proposed to my mother in the Ratner's on Delancey--back in 1952.<BR/>So without Ratner's...where would I be? Thank you for writing this!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-33519004272753994062008-04-03T21:08:00.000-04:002008-04-03T21:08:00.000-04:00Wow this is one of the best posts so far! I love the depth of the research and the conjectures - it's great to follow your mind down this path. And it seems like others are digging it too:<BR/><BR/>http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2008/04/state_senators_theyre_just_lik.html<BR/><BR/>Thanks also to the more eloquent "Anonymous" for the first person insights and clarifications.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-37320315735795329002008-04-03T17:47:00.000-04:002008-04-03T17:47:00.000-04:00I wonder if the 2nd Avenue Ratner's was a deli, as opposed to the dairy restaurant on Delancey. Any idea?BaHanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-11202164133710755312008-04-03T17:30:00.000-04:002008-04-03T17:30:00.000-04:00Bravo Jeremiah! I am posting Tony's flicker site on my blog and praising you.<BR/><BR/>I am a huge Janis Joplin fan and I remember seeing some pic of her at Ratners.<BR/><BR/>My Dad and I would eat at the other Ratner's before it closed. Thanks for the research.<BR/><BR/>I did not attend the phony NYU public relations meeting because I am sick of the "non action". Could you imagine if they responded to us with the rapidity of tearing down historic New York and supersizing it with hideous NYU mega domination?<BR/><BR/>NYU is a mega-predator that waits for buildings to empty out so they can buy, lease them and they only thing John Sexton, Amanda Burden and the mayor have not done is provide buses, NYU trolleys and trains to move us out.<BR/><BR/>I was so glad the turn out for the NYU meeting was huge and outraged...the usual large turn out.<BR/><BR/>I heard some moving feedback including an elderly handicapped woman who asked where is she going to shop for food? <BR/><BR/>Well done as usual!!!!!<BR/>SuzannahSuzannah B. Troy artisthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16443929935641399108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-31707026058514555302008-04-03T16:04:00.000-04:002008-04-03T16:04:00.000-04:00Jeremiah-<BR/>I don't know anything about the Harmatz family history other than the two branches of the family which separately owned both Ratner's did not speak to each other- right up to the very end. <BR/>Let me refer you to the photo book "Live at The Fillmore East" by Amalie R. Rothschild (c) 1999)Page 133 for a picture of the Fillmore Crew having breakfast at Ratner's 2nd Avenue at 5AM (Date unknown). My father is standing in the center nearest the bus boy. Page 125 also features a great elongated photo of 2nd avenue between 6th & 7th Streets showing The Fillmore, Ratner's, and The Dry Dock Savings Bank.<BR/>-Sam Jaffe's SonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-42614961950307854172008-04-03T15:56:00.000-04:002008-04-03T15:56:00.000-04:00thank you baha--i wouldn't have done that research without your query!Jeremiah Mosshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11791516443125872364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-43434057188758200312008-04-03T15:43:00.000-04:002008-04-03T15:43:00.000-04:00I'm glad, Jeremiah, that we were both right!BaHanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-88056633309924937572008-04-03T15:17:00.000-04:002008-04-03T15:17:00.000-04:00hey "sam jaffe's son," thanks for the insider info! feel free to share more. and what do you think, why the weird omission of harry and abraham in ratner's history?Jeremiah Mosshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11791516443125872364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-70517579964019742852008-04-03T14:51:00.000-04:002008-04-03T14:51:00.000-04:00The fact of the matter is that the 2nd Ave Ratner's was not a step child of the "survivor" on Delancey Street. When my father was night manager from the late <BR/>50's until closing, the 2nd Avenue Ratner's did much better business than Delancey Street! And my father stocked the Fillmore's mezzanine food concession with Ratner's baked delicacies. (Ratner's free standing bakery was located a few doors north on 2nd Avenue). I became a "gansa macher" in the music industry and Bill Graham always referred to me as "Sam Jaffe's son," as if I never had a first name, no matter how many times we came in contact.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-80870836968643182312008-04-03T14:04:00.000-04:002008-04-03T14:04:00.000-04:00I wonder if this 1969 fire was the same one which saw a plainsclothes cop take the stage at the Fillmore to clear the place out while the Who were premiering "Tommy" to American audiences. Seeing an interloper onstage, Pete Townshend reacted with his usual sang froid by kicking him in the balls (this was the same year he pounded Abbie Hoffman into the crowd at Woodstock with his guitar), and was arrested. He later pleaded to a lesser charge.kingofnycabbiesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-9150464572591383922008-04-03T13:23:00.000-04:002008-04-03T13:23:00.000-04:00I myself have always thought that the period we're living in now (roughly 1999-to ?) will be of great histoical and sociological interest to future generations. Whether this interest will take the form of fawning admiration (as I'm sure the yunnie and his parents imagine it will) is somewhat more up in the air. ;)<BR/><BR/>In regards to the photos of Ratner's, isn't it a shame that locating photos of a decades-old neighborhood fixture is so difficult? To me, this really says a lot about the importance of photographic documentation. I'd recommend that everyone who can ought to take photos of the ordinary things they like in this city, especially now that personal cameras are so widespread, as the yunnie's flip-flopped footprint can come down hard on a neighborhood without very much advanced notice.Joshuanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-31764747159510715762008-04-03T12:44:00.000-04:002008-04-03T12:44:00.000-04:00This was fascinating! But do you think that in the future, people will write and readers will be fascinated by the stories of Trump et al who managed to destroy NYC? Will the short fingered vulgarians and their starchitectural combovers leave histories to merit any interest by the golden children of the future?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-283734300987477202008-04-03T11:22:00.000-04:002008-04-03T11:22:00.000-04:00thanks everybody--i am rather in love with this story, too--if you do know anyone who can shed light on the Harmatz brothers and their story, please do let me know.Jeremiah Mosshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11791516443125872364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-72075006173813489722008-04-03T10:07:00.000-04:002008-04-03T10:07:00.000-04:00On the next block was Rappoports, also dairy and my grandfather's favorite. A victim of the 60's...sigh.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-11637341522510908822008-04-03T10:04:00.000-04:002008-04-03T10:04:00.000-04:00Fantastic post Jeremiah. I sent it to a friend whose father worked at Ratners although I'm not sure which location.<BR/><BR/>- Tim (Stupefaction)Karate Boogaloohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04517788409617221144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-36238100984823466912008-04-03T10:02:00.000-04:002008-04-03T10:02:00.000-04:00Bravo, Jeremiah. Excellent stuff.<BR/>I'm curious about the brothers now too.ev grievehttp://sophiesbar.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-683382864156505640.post-10327858605012681372008-04-03T09:54:00.000-04:002008-04-03T09:54:00.000-04:00Excellent job here. I love the Tony Marciante photos. Especially the last one in the fire series with the woman comforting a distraught parrot.ShatteredMonoclenoreply@blogger.com